Jama

Jama

@Jama

  • He/him

Tabletop, video games, sports and maybe someday some other things if I get the ambition to learn.

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Jama
@Jama
Jama
@Jama
Jama
@Jama

"Oh hey there's this cool thing that does 8 damage at range 20, perfect for scaring my party >:)"

"Oh, they have an intercept system from the Napoleon and they kept recharging it and beating the contested rolls when it targeted him, blocking the shot... fuck"

Jama
@Jama

Holding up a big neon sign saying "Play to the objective, there are other actions beyond Skirmish, Boost, and Barrage"

Jama
@Jama

I'm not sure, but I might need to add another player down the line, if their frame unlocks at LL2 still lead to the same "One person actually goes out while the other two hang back and the one that goes out takes more structure damage because they're the only one in range" type things. The character with the most HP (17) is the one that took the sniper rifle and doesn't go forward. Going to put the party's builds under the cut, maybe get some feedback here because maybe I'm just fucking up by not trying to ambush the back two.

It's also very funny that the weapon spread among the party is 3 shotguns (one is the Deck Sweeper from Tortuga), two Mortars, and then a melee weapon (two players have a knife + a second Aux weapon).

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in reply to @Jama's post:

Jama
@Jama

Hornets will continue until E. defence is targeted

A question real quick: Are grunts immune to Reliable damage due to the wording on Chaff? Or do they only ignore the half-damage stuff?

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in reply to @Jama's post:

Jama
@Jama

This party is actively afraid of taking heat or damage, to the point where they nearly failed both missions last night due to turn limits. Without them, they'd turtle up and just attrition them to death lmao.

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Arcalane
@Arcalane

Whilst I'm not intimately familiar with encounter balancing in Lancer, it sounds like your team needs to be provided with objectives and/or threats that incentivize them to move more. Artillery barrages, inclement weather, melee attackers and area-effects that Interdiction Point can't stop so easily, that kinda thing.

They might also be in the mindset that "0HP = Dead", where Lancer seems really more like "you have three extra healthbars like you're your very own boss fight, SO USE THEM".

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Maersk-Aerospace
@Maersk-Aerospace

i'm not sure if the builds got left out or if my cohost broke but:

  • try some Specters and Cataphracts to run down the backliners
  • try some Bombards and Striders to outcompete them at range
  • run an Extraction or Gauntlet sitrep. nobody gets to sit around and wait because they'll get left behind.

i'd recommend being open about the fact that you're doing this - not in a "talking is the real metagame" way, but in a "lancer works well with total or near-total open information" way. you can tell them before or after they set their loadouts, or just hint at it in briefings, but you should be able to force their hands on that front. it's not even per se bad form to ambush your players, but leave 'em no excuses - they make better choices or they die!

also: it's going to suck for the guy who frontlines, but it's valid, balanced, and fit-for-purpose to merc him and then run your normal frontliners to the backline. mechs come back, and there's a billion reasons enemies wouldn't just kill pilots. worst-case scenario, you can have your player grab an enemy mech - they're Slowed and Impaired while piloting any mech but their own, but it gets 'em back in. either way, applying real pressure but letting the see it doesn't cook their game experience will teach em to use structure as the resource it is.

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Jama
@Jama

Oh whoops I had changed my mind on posting the builds but forgot to edit the rest of the post to reflect that. I'll tackle the rest when I'm at my computer though. Lot to go through lmao.

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Jama
@Jama

So, to complete the above thoughts: Builds are all in Everest, LL1.
Chase the Sun: HP 17 (H 2, A0, S0, E1) - Tortuga T1, Charge Blade, Deck Sweeper Shotgun, Anti-material Rifle.
Talents: Juggernaut 2, Grease Monkey 1, Vanguard 1.
Systems: Jericho Deployable Cover, Personalization, Custom Paint Job, Siege Ram, Eva Module

Psalms 23: HP 11 (H0, A1, S2, E0) - Napoleon T1, Shotgun, Tactical Knife/Missile Rack, Mortar
Talents: Leader 2, Combined Arms 1, Walking Armory 1
Systems: Jericho Deployable Cover, Eva Module, Type 3 Projection Shields, Manipulators, Stasis Bolt

Coherence of Dissenters: HP 11 (H0, A2, S0, E1) - Manticore 1, Shotgun, Segment Knife/Catalyst Pistol, Mortar
Talents: Skirmisher 2, Nuclear Cavalier 1, Siege Specialist 1
Systems: Custom Paint Job, Type 1 Flight System, Beckoner, Eva Module

Cataphracts were used last session to break them up, but the party kept doing the thing of just trying to swing at them while Engaged with a shotgun. I used Spectres the first mission but they haaaaated the Invisible status. Tried to out range them with the Titan, but they just out-skilled him with the Napoleon's Stasis bolt, so I'm not mad at that.

I had a weird hybrid escort/Extraction mission where they had to get to an extraction point on the other side of the map, and they only made it because I accidentally gave them too few turns. Otherwise they were focused on Destroying The Enemy rather than going to the zone. Second fight was a Recon one to find the entrance to a hideout, which went a little better, but the speediest guy got locked into a fight for a lot of rounds, pulling himself into Engagement and staying there for two-three rounds. THe Napoleon player though grasped the situation and went for objectives, but couldn't cover 3 of them. THe funny thing is that the Manticore player, while being locked in combat, allowed a grunt Seeder to lay a bunch of mines in his area of the map, Which he then ran into.

I'm hoping that them getting more stuff will inform them to use more stuff, but I'm not sure. They've only used the free quick action that the Everest gives a couple times overall in 5 fights, and they didn't use their core power yet on this mission with one fight to go.

As for information, I don't hide anything but reinforcements. I outline that the objective is X, you have Y turns, here is the difficult terrain and cover. I also try to use a variety of actions on the NPCs end to kind of showcase things like tech actions, reactions and such to try to go "hey, here's what's available".

They did start to use Overcharge last time so that's progress too. I might be overreacting by expecting them to utilize everything at once, but I had hoped that when they saw that the Invade quick tech was Very Good in terms of slowing down enemies they would use it more, but nah.

Sorry for the essay of a reply!
I'm only 3 sessions in so I'm probably overreacting though.

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Maersk-Aerospace
@Maersk-Aerospace

three sessions in people are still probably finding their legs, yeah. i'd still suggest doing some harder sitreps that don't let them form bad habits, and also - as much as i've counciled against not running roughshod over them for no reason - don't be afraid to drive the knife home. if a Cataphract is glued to a dude and he can't reliably hit it or hurt it because of the PD shield, just kill 'em. mechs come back. structure comes back. all you lose from a PC mech loss is their capacity for the mission. if they hate Specter invisibility, tough shit - group up as you move or get cooked. hit 'em with some Demolishers and/or Goliaths (plural) to give 'em something they'll have a tough time chewing through and let 'em cook if they don't adapt. better early than later!

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