Game programmer, designer, director; retired quadball player; antimeme; radical descriptivist; antilabel; Moose;

Working at Muse Games. Directed Embr, worked on Wildmender and Guns of Icarus, Making new secret stuffs

Opinions are everyone else's


Kayin
@Kayin

Another Blog repost. Click here to get the full experience with images. Or don't, it doesn't need them

Final Fantasy 7 Rebirth released a demo and... there are yellow painted cliffs, reigniting a conversation that keeps coming up every few months. Now, I have no exact opinion on it's use in FF7R. It seems to be explained in universe (it's a temporary route, purposefully marked), and marking paths is hardly a sin. Hinting at the so called Golden Path is a fundamental aspect of level design. This isn't about FF7R.

... But oh god did it unfortunately choose that yellow paint that has come to symbolize a type of hand holding that has been wearing on players over the last decade. It has started to feel similar to the ancient Old Man Murray "Start to Crate" system, judging a game on "How long it took to see a crate", representing the point where "the developers ran out of ideas".

This standard wasn't exactly fair and neither is judging a game on using yellow paint. FF7R is probably fine, because again, this isn't about FF7R. It is, of course, not even about the yellow paint. It's about what the yellow paint represents.

It's Not About Leaving the Player to Struggle

A lot of people have responded to this pushback saying of COURSE modern games have to do this. They have to appeal to everyone. People didn't spend $60 dollars on a game just to get lost. Companies have to do this to make money you know!

But they don't have to. People will quickly point to Souls games, and while that works, those games always seem like the don't count. The exception, no matter how much they sell. You can't actually learn from them (even if you obviously can)... but I'm going to talk about Nintendo. Nintendo has played around on all fronts of tutorialization. Nintendo has many different kind of designers working for them. They can fall into bad habits like all of us but they tend to be ahead of the curve. Even going back to Super Mario Odyssey you can see what they chose to and what they chose not to communicate. You get your magic hat. It tells you to use it immediately. On the side of the screen is a video of human hands, doing the motion to throw your hat. The game wants to make sure you know how to use this basic ability.

... But then it doesn't tell you what to do with it. It doesn't even tell you what it does. It just surrounds you with things that can interact with this ability. It creates a space for play. You're here to play the game, right? "Oh here is a ledge that is too tall? Try catching this frog" ... and then what? Like obviously you know, and the game isn't even trying to make you feel clever for using the ability to jump without being told. You're not being told what to do because there isn't any rush. You'll jump up when you're ready. Because you're here to play... right?

Nintendo games will do things to help stuck player, to nudge them along. They'll use, like everyone else, basic level design to guide you around, but the goal usually isn't to get you to go The right way but to show you all the places you can go so you can play.

... And Dark Souls isn't much different. We might want to pretend the game is negligently unconcerned with our enjoyment but it is merely doing as much as it feels it needs to do to encourage play. Getting lost is part of the play, so you are given enough room to get lost. But discovery is also an important part of the experience so there needs to be enough things to entertain yourself finding before you stumble onto the right path. The game isn't indifferent to you, it's trying to enrich you and give you what it sees to be a good experience.

It's Not About Tricking Players into Thinking They're Smart

A type of response I saw from a lot of fellow game designers who didn't immediately dismiss the issue went kinda like this... "Okay look, players don't mind being lead around! They just don't like when it's obvious! They want to be lead around! So we have to trick them better so they think they're clever."

The painful thing here is that the general idea isn't wrong. The framing though... it bugs me. It bugs me a lot. People would accuse me and I Wanna be the Guy of adversarial game design, but honestly, no. I think this is adversarial. Not having a fun, playful relationship with the player, but looking at the player as an obstacle between us and our intended experience.

A designer friend of mine, Zara, said "Maybe it'd help if we didn't see players as a particularly stubborn breed of dog" and I feel like that's how a lot of designers look at game design. Like we're magicians, trying to fake emotions and accomplishments. We will lead the horse to water, and we will make them drink their $60+ worth of game. Nobody thinks they're smart for finding the ladder... and sure, they might feel dumb if they can't find the ladder. But we all feel dumb when we don't feel like we're trusted enough to even try.

If we design our games with the assumption that the player is an idiot, then they will feel that resentment when we hold their hand.

Enrichment, Agency, and Overly Paternalistic Game Design

As a kid, did you ever plan on doing something useful without being asked? Taking out the trash, or doing the dishes unprompted? Being proactive, showing thoughtfulness? ... and as you walk out of your room to do to the thing, a parent turns to you and goes "Hey, can you take out the trash?"

Maybe it's not with a parent. Maybe it's a boss, or a loved one. Regardless, no one in this situation is doing anything wrong but gosh does it feel like something was taken away... Worse, it often isn't as enjoyable as it would have been if you just went out and did it without them saying anything. It has been turned back into work. Repeat this too often and a person might feel like no one thinks they're capable of making the right choices on their own. They lose their feeling of agency.

Game Designers force this situation a lot in modern times. Overly aggressive popups, color coding, 'helpful' partners who bark the solution to a puzzle at you while you're just looking around for a moment. Waypoints for everything, markers for everything. All of these things good in their own context, useful design elements when appropriately applied, stacked upon each other until the game designer becomes a hover parent trying to ensure the perfect experience. You must be protected from yourself. What if you get lost? What if you don't know what to do?

Hinting through level design is not new. It's ancient technology. Super Mario Bros' coins, Donkey Kong Country's bananas, every aspect of Doom's level design always tries to give you some idea where you should be going. Dark Souls does not lead you to grope blindly. Buildings convey their importance in the distance. Lighting cues help guide you. Even enemies can be a way to funnel you were you should go. The thing is though... Most of these old things aren't 'compulsory'. They are used to set the expectation. To get you to try new things. Mario will use coins to get you to jump places to do things you don't even expect to happen. Oh, what, I can break out of the ceiling? And I only noticed because I tried to get some coins? You are taught what to look for, and then you are allowed to find it later on your own. Games like DKC, or something like Super Metroid create a relationship with the player. These hints get played with, subverted, omitted, and inverted, all to slowly expand the problem space in your mind to help you have enriching play.

A lot of modern, condescending game design fails to create enrichment. It's about going on the ride. It's the overly scheduled trip to Europe your friend planned that has an itinerary down to the hour. Homie, we're not going to Europe again for years! We gotta MAXIMIZE. But by maximizing, you miss the real experience. You miss the lazy morning in Paris, wandering around until you find an espresso place. You don't look at the reviews, you just go in. You have an authentic, human experience. Could you have gotten better coffee? Could you have planned to take a bus at 8:45 over across the city to have coffee at the 3rd best reviewed espresso place in all of France? Sure, but are you here for the coffee, or are you here for the experience? It is the down time, the space between the notes that make experiences special. You don't get that when your character is telling you what you should be doing every 10 steps in whatever current grey goo ubisoft game is out right now.

People worry about games now being made for stupid people. Dumbed down for idiots. I don't like that kind of disdainful thinking, judging peoples intelligence by how they interact with mainstream videogames. No, instead, we make games for the uninvested. Games for the people who want the sampler plater of the current zeitgeist. A child, with an brain not yet fully developed, will get through these games. They will look up answers. They aren't getting every release. It isn't about intelligence. They are getting through these games because they care more, and they have been doing this since home consoles were a thing. Meanwhile, most of my peers are more concerned with avoiding FOMO.

Do players get stuck on the simplest things? Absolutely. But no one buys a 60 dollar game and gives up on it because of some easy problem that can be solved with a google search. They give up because they have 3 other 60 dollar games waiting to be played. I am left wondering if game devs are more concerned with fun experiences, or avoiding negative ones. That when you don't finish their game, you at least remember it fondly. That you come back for the DLC. That you consider the sequel. If you have to make too many decisions, you might make unfun ones, so they keep you on a tight gameplay loop.

It's not the made-up mythical "stupid gamers" (we all get stuck in silly ways and no one should be ashamed of that) bringing things down for everyone. It is our peers, who care more about being current than taking in an experience. Because we'll all get through whatever game ultimately catches our interest, no matter how obtuse it gets. But game devs can't count on that, so they keep you moving. It's Speed, with Keanu Reeves. Drop under 50 MPH and the player gets bored and moves on to the next Call of Duty game. Players will buy a game but don't play it with respect, instead turning a lot of their playtime into some weird cultural obligation, like watching the next marvel movie.

Game developers have a problem too. A huge problem is that watching someone get stuff is a thousand times worse than being stuck. This isn't just a developer problem, look at any twitch chat while someone is playing Dark Souls. Now imagine you made the game and you're watching. It's torture. My friend who conducts testing has to tell game devs to stay hands off. No interfering with the test!! The urge is there though. Every spot must be sanded down because watching someone get stuck for even a minute is worse than having a grain of sand stuck in your eye. But testing has it's limitations. It can help you see how intuitive a menu is, or how well new players can understand your mechanics, but you can't recreate the moment of a bunch of people buying a new game and talking about it. Or recreate the focus and stubbornness of someone who has been waiting for this game for five years. It's the same reason you get a lot of weird stories about successful movies having bad test screenings. You cannot simulate your release audience. But you can polish a game until all texture is gone, and the experience is like a line at disneyland. Well designed, impressively built, highly detailed, but still... a vapid experience, cosplaying as a richer one.

Players don't respect the games they play enough to let themselves get stuck, and designers don't trust them enough to get stuck. This is the end result of a relationship built on disrespect, condescending parents speaking down to their disinterested children, who are so used to being micromanaged that they've gone numb. Testing can tell you a lot of things, but not what years of disrespect will cause in the player base.

It's not about yellow paint, it's about the fact the modern AAA space has forgotten how to have a dialog with the player. It has forgotten how to enrich and has instead decided to only try and wow. Most players don't even notice. They're so far behind in their backlog that they want content that can go down easily, not because they're not capable, but because they're overwhelmed. Culture moves so fast.

The yellow paint is just a reminder. Another unneeded reminder to do the dishes.


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in reply to @Kayin's post:

i am screaming! all of this!!

in fact i am LITERALLY making a video essay about this in addition to other things. i was terrified when i saw the article that you'd make all the points i was gonna make. we go different ways with it though.

craziest of all, i wanna be the guy is how i introduce talking about hostile game design as a means of explaining games can do things that seem """bad""" in a very purposeful way to direct the player to something good

Nice!!! There is definitely a lot of room to cover the same topic, so I'm glad I didn't actually snipe you! Even with just my own opinions I had to leave a lot on the cutting room floor. 😭

This one is really driving in the Nail of Discourse with a tactical nuke, and I mean that as the highest praise. Especially the note about holiday planning resonates for me - it's such a perfect analogy to my experience it actually made me laugh from surprise.

thank you for giving that reframe of uninvested; i have been trying to figure out what that factor is. i have been playing games a long time and i love them but sometimes i feel like many commercial releases these days didnt reward me for caring and this is why. it is like loving artificial rock climbing walls and finding out most of the people who build them have started making playground equipment for kids instead. or something, heh

Combo trials in fighting games remind me a lot of the Play approach. Something like Under Night In-Birth trials often teach you pretty decent combos that teach you useful portions by having them show up over and over again. Not only does it teach you that a certain combo part is good, it teaches you that you can go combine combo parts in interesting ways, encouraging you to explore the play space and come up with your own. I really like that method of tutorialization.

I do wonder how much the modern dev cycle is contributing to it, too. Morale in the industry is miserable, and has been for some time now. It's hard to find the motivation to make a playground to check out the Cool New Button and see what it can do when you're coming into Year 5 of development on a game in a genre that's turned stale, tired, even outright hated (but it was the Hot New Thing when the project was greenlit!), crunch has been going for months despite release still being a year away, mass layoffs happen at other studios in your company umbrella every other day, and the same suits responsible arbitrarily decided your game needs a battlepass and monthly subscription with announced-already DLC, despite being a narrative single-player game.

Starts feeling tempting to just slather on some neon yellow to the next door, in a way I can't fault the dev with the brush for in the slightest.

I feel like in terms of like, everything modern devs have everything going against them. Even a lot of yellow signals feel like "oh god we tried to make something obvious but we didn't plan well oh god we changed the lighting engine, we can't see that hand hold and and... aw fuck it, yellow paint!"

I have never seen the yellow paint in person, but anyway i feel like it's weird the industry has 'good design' and 'genera/franchise' split - i'd imagine a big game to work fine being a celebration of the culture from a franchise or some semi new upcoming area.
It would mean good design is like an unneeded reflection of just what you find in a particular culture. That seems to make clear where the disrespect comes from.
not continuing with a personal note but wanted to involve at least that much which is a conclusion for me

Alright, you've inspired me to write a full article on this now.

So here's my quick thoughts on the yellow paint, hand-holding, and visual communication / semiotics.

So, I grew up with a lot of the same stuff you did, and it got annoying how games got easier and more "handhold-y" over time, and eventually it's like, "wait, why do I care if the game is telling me how to play it?" Mirror's Edge highlighted objects in Red and everyone thought that was genius. Assassin's Creed has handholds sticking clearly out of walls and there's little doubt what's interactable there. Games establish a clear semiotic of which objects can be interacted with all the time. Games tell you how to play them all the time. NES games had detailed instruction books that sometimes told you how all the enemies moved.

The question is, what do we actually value here? Personally, I value when a game doesn't waste my time with an unskippable sequence where I can't play, and I value when a game is deep. The question isn't, "well, I feel like the game thinks I'm a stupid baby." It's whether there's actually a range of viable strategies and dynamic skill tests and whether it wastes my time.

Doom Eternal had pop-ups that highlighted enemy weak points, and a lot of people without any sense of the scientific method in their hearts thought that's what the game was about, rather than realizing that disarming enemies was slower and did less damage than a rocket or a close range shotgun, meaning it was a tradeoff to disarm enemies, not obligatory.

The issue with every game that uses Yellow Paint is that climbing isn't a skill test, it's not a dynamic challenge intended to make you think or consider. It's the same as having rooms separated by doors, or simply a ladder. This particular yellow paint ledge is the only way you can go, and they have it there so that you're doing something other than walking. It's padding, not substance. Psychonauts 2 has some tiny lakes and little rafts that can ride between docks and nothing else. This doesn't exist to create a broader system of play, it's padding.

The cliff you can climb is painted yellow for the same reason doors you can open are colored differently than ones you can't. It's because the environment is set up with only one way to go, and there's so much detail in modern game environments that if they don't highlight what's important to separate it from the set dressing, you'll get lost trying to interact with the set dressing. Nintendo games and dark souls avoid this problem by simply not having set dressing, or having set dressing with no resemblance to interactables. If Dark Souls wants you to climb up somewhere, they stick a ladder, even if it makes absolutely no logical sense, and nobody has ever questioned why there's a ladder from Darkroot Basin to the Grave of Artorias, or called it hand-holding.

The AAA-ification of games isn't that they're getting more hand-holdy, it's that they're getting more rote. They're not being designed as systems of gameplay, just content. The designers say, "Spiderman needs to web sling, make it happen" and some people stitch together some animations of web slinging and use IK and particles to make it look like he's convincingly doing the thing no matter which direction you're moving in. "Oh, we want to climb a cliff here, make it happen", so some animations get made, some interaction points get set. They notice in the playtest that players keep trying to climb a wall that doesn't have the interaction points, so they make it more obvious what the correct wall to climb is, and then gamers say, "Hey, stop treating me like I'm a kid." But if you don't have a ton of superfluous detail in your environments, your game won't sell, so you can't have it both ways. And ultimately, there's only one place to climb, so who actually cares if it's marked clearly? This isn't Breath of the Wild where you can climb anywhere, and it isn't trying to be Breath of the Wild, so adding that feature would break the game, or require them proofing it against you doing that. Designers are building games where they really want you to do one or two specific things only, except in the designated combat arenas, where you can go ham on enemies. They want a mission where you blackmail the green goblin by stealing a secret document and planting a letter bomb or some business, and apart from the regularly spaced combat arenas you step into, that whole mission is a sequence of interaction points where you press A to interact and hold forward to run/climb/walk slowly while talking to someone on the codec until it's done.

People can't learn from Dark Souls, because they don't understand the lesson.

I like this a lot, even if it kinda disagrees with me in some ways. It plays back into the same idea. Stuff doesn't try to create any sort of play. You don't even need complicated systems to encourage play (though gosh please it helps please I beg you). When the FF7R stuff came up at first my response was "This is actually kinda fine outside the fact that I don't think I've ever been happy to see a AAA climbing segment". 😭

I've been working with a number of professional developers recently, and the sense I get (which they've somewhat confirmed) is that this utilitarian approach to design is really common in anglosphere AAA game development. It's less about creating a system of play (complex or not) and more about just making something that satisfies the needs of whatever fantasy they want to sell you. And Yellow Paint is just a completely utilitarian endpoint to that. It's less annoying for what it is, and more annoying for what underlying design trends it calls attention to.

It took a while for me to realize it but there are a couple things Dark Souls tries to subtly convey that it just whiffs on. No disrespect, game's amazing and every time they do this sort of thing and it works it feels just amazing.
Capra Demon is a boss people struggle with, fast, does high damage, but has a critical weakness in that its attacks don't do a ton of stamina damage - you can just block everything but its overhead. The game tries to tell you this ahead of time, via item description. There's a drop you can get in the area leading up to the boss that talks about the Capra Demon as being a leader of a gang of thieves. You fight a bunch of these thieves on the way to the boss. The thieves...deal a lot of damage but you can easily stuff their attacks with a good shield because they don't do a ton of stamina damage. Mechanically very similar! The game is trying to get you to say "oh Capra Demon is just like these thieves and if I approach the fight the same way I will win!" I don't know if a single player in the history of the game made that connection other than after the fact.

reminded of a guy who kept adamantly trying to change the sprites on an SS13 repo for explosive barrels from metal-with-green-goo literally eyedroppered from the 1993 Doom sprites to red plastic drums, with his entire reasoning being that "explosive barrels should be red, that's how professional games do it".