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JoyfulSanity
@JoyfulSanity

Survive the fall from grace

Though Shin Megami Tensei V was originally released in 2021, Shin Megami Tensei V: Vengeance feels tailor-made for 2024.

In only a handful of minutes after starting the game, I found myself in a world that has long since been destroyed. Armies of angels and demons fight for dominance over the ruins of Tokyo, and all I can do is survive amidst the chaos. In many ways, 2024 has felt similarly apocalyptic. The games industry has callously killed over 10,000 jobs (already surpassing the employment bloodbath that was 2023), and the institution of journalism is in absolute freefall. As prideful CEOs battle each other in pursuit of fleeting trends while flesh-and-blood humans are discarded like broken toys, the world in Shin Megami Tensei V feels closer to reality than it ever should. Who should you root for when no one has your best interests in mind?

Based on my (albeit limited) experience with the Shin Megami Tensei series, I know I’ll probably want to pick a side sooner or later. However, after spending roughly 20 hours with the game, I haven’t cared much about that dilemma. Instead, I’ve enjoyed exploring the vast wastelands, doing favors for demons, and constructing my dream team of misfit monsters. The world is dead, but I can’t remember the last time I had so much fun. Somehow, there’s beauty in desolation.

Nahobino walking through Da'at in Shin Megami Tensei V

When the thousand years have expired

At the very beginning of Shin Megami Tensei V, you have the choice to either play the story path from the original game or embark on the new Vengeance story. Even though this is my first rodeo in Da’at, I selected Vengeance. This decision was primarily influenced by what I could write about (I’ve been contributing guides to Kotaku these past couple months), but I’m glad this is how I’m first experiencing the game. The reasons why will become evident later.

As mentioned above, the game almost immediately thrusts you into the boundless sands of its alternate universe, referred to as Da’at. This wide netherworld feels overwhelming at first, and generally speaking, I dislike feeling lost in big open world games. However, Shin Megami Tensei V threads a very careful needle in its map design. I always feel I have a lot to explore at any given time, but within five or ten minutes, I have a mental lay of the land and can focus on unearthing secrets. Maybe I don’t have a countless number of paths I can follow. But every path I’ve taken has been well worth exploring.

Part of this appeal comes from Shin Megami Tensei V’s willingness to take advantage of its 3D space. In many RPGs, the jump button primarily exists to take a few shortcuts or enable combos in a real-time combat system. Meanwhile, Shin Megami Tensei V isn’t afraid to throw some light platforming at you here and there. Oftentimes, you’ll see a treasure chest in the distance, wonder “how do I get up there,” and find a roundabout path that gets you where you want to go. Shin Megami Tensei V isn’t revolutionary in this respect, but for a turn-based RPG, the sense of exploration is delightful.

Nahobino talking with Legion in Shin Megami Tensei V

Drink of the wine of the wrath of God

Of course, the real draw of Shin Megami Tensei comes from fusing and creating your own party of demon companions. I thought I knew what to expect from Shin Megami Tensei V: Vengeance in this respect, but what I didn’t expect is that I’d get so attached to all these creatures.

For a game with over 200 unique monsters, they’re all overflowing with personality. As per series tradition, you can talk with demons in normal encounters, and successfully bargaining with them or recruiting them involves reading their tone and matching their energy. After playing so much Persona and dissecting its static social link conversations, the unpredictable outcomes of demon negotiation scratch the social combat itch I’ve had for about a year now. It’s so exciting to encounter a brand new demon, and there’s real tension in negotiating for their companionship without upsetting them.

But it’s not just the recruitment segments that make each demon so lively. New to Shin Megami Tensei V: Vengeance are Demon Haunts, which are open areas where you can freely talk with your party members. This is where you really get to know your companions' idiosyncrasies. For example, Leanan Sidhe once told me that she couldn’t see any love in my eyes (which, I mean, fair). And meanwhile, the otherwise abrasive Ippon-Datara confided in me that it can’t find any shoes that fit its long feet.

Despite the grim setting of the game, there’s something so realistic about how these creatures can talk philosophy in one minute and share anxieties about banal parts of life in the next. And it’s not like they’re all guaranteed to like you either; Legion and I have a firm understanding that it wants me to fear it. The earnestness here ironically makes the demons feel more human than many human characters in RPGs.

I don’t consume a lot of booze these days, but you could easily make a drinking game out of every time I’ve said “same” in response to the demons’ dialogue.

Nahobino talking with Oni in Shin Megami Tensei V

I have your back to the wall

My favorite part of the demon interactions is when the quests, dialogue, and gameplay all come together to form weirdly compelling short stories. My favorite example of this so far is Oni, the giant red brute. During one sidequest, Oni asks you to find any demons that might need its help, since it’s lonely and figures someone might need a bodyguard. This doesn’t go well right off the bat, since Oni is… well, a bit of a violent maniac. Frankly, Oni scares me. If I met it in real life, I’d probably be one wrong look away from it removing my head from my body. Yet despite that, deep down, it seems like it kind of has its heart in the right place.

This is actually reflected in Oni’s skillset. Its base skills are strictly physical attacks; no nuance, just damage against one or multiple monsters. But once it levels up, it learns Taunt (letting it take hits for the party) and Fang Breaker (a physical debuff attack). Oni grows into and excels at being a tank for the party, which really helps out in at least one fight in Shin Megami Tensei V: Vengeance. My time using and raising Oni felt like an extension of the story the game already told, and I couldn’t help but cheer for it as it took potentially lethal hits in my stead.

Admittedly, this questline was already present in the vanilla version of Shin Megami Tensei V. But Vengeance does add new quests, delivering more of these little stories that flesh out the monsters so well. Honestly, I’ve started to feel bad about using demons as fusion fodder once they become outclassed by other monsters I could use. I like to think of the fused monsters as Pokemon-style evolutions rather than flat-out replacements, even if the lore of the game doesn’t necessarily support that interpretation.

Yoko Hiromine on the dorm roof during a cutscene in Shin Megami Tensei V

One more god rejected

Aside from the lovable demons, there is one human in Shin Megami Tensei V: Vengeance that I like an awful lot so far: Yoko Hiromine.

As the new character in the Vengeance story path, Yoko quickly proves to be an invaluable ally. She’s a “Guest” character that can join battles as long as she's with you, and her diverse set of skills often comes in clutch. Shin Megami Tensei V’s battle system is absolutely exquisite, featuring a rich array of options and possibilities that make battles and team building consistently dynamic. So not only does the inclusion of Guest characters expand your combat capabilities, they serve as reliable party members to use if you’re ever struggling with the team building aspects of the game.

But more importantly, it’s Yoko’s function in the story that really endears me to her. Just as I can’t find myself aligning with the major powers of Shin Megami Tensei V’s story, Yoko similarly expresses skepticism to virtually everyone she meets. She sees right through angels that take advantage of me, and she’s not afraid to call boss enemies out on their hypocrisy after they make speeches filled with platitudes.

However, she’s not totally cold to the world. She seems to trust my player character, and isn’t afraid to say a kind word or two when the situation arises. Yoko also appears to value the weird group of humans that I suppose are my friends, especially when they prove they can put others above themselves. I compared one particular story beat in the Vengeance story with how it played out in the original canon, and Yoko’s inclusion made the outcome far more interesting. The Vengeance path incorporates Yoko so well into the plot that I often forget that she wasn’t always there.

Yoko has felt like a kindred spirit in Shin Megami Tensei V’s world. So far, she often says what I’m already thinking, and that companionship is welcome in a landscape so devoid of hope. I might regret this stance as I learn more about her in the story. But in the meantime, I’m really happy she’s here.

Nahobino casting Miracle Water during a battle in Shin Megami Tensei V

I am the bug inside you

If I had one major complaint about Shin Megami Tensei V: Vengeance so far, it’s that it immediately loses intrigue once it pulls you out of Da’at. The sense of adventure and mystery in that barren wasteland was absolutely enthralling, and having it be explained away through some decidedly more conventional tropes detracted from my immersion.

But more importantly, leaving Da’at brought me back to all the parts of the world I don’t like. The major overarching powers dictate what you can or can’t do, yet they’ve done absolutely nothing to earn my trust. It’s disappointing, but in the end, it’s not enough to keep me from pressing on. If I move forward, I’ll learn more about Yoko. I’ll find more corners of Da’at to explore, uncovering all its treasures and conquering all its challenges. And, most importantly, I’ll get to hang out with more demons and learn their stories.

Life doesn’t always work out the way you hope it would. Oftentimes, it feels like you’re not making choices you really believe in, but instead selecting which option is the least bad from what you’re given. It’s demoralizing, and under those circumstances, it’s all too easy to just give up hope completely. But it’s those little things that make moving forward worthwhile. The one friend you may make, the one adventure you’ve yet to experience; that’s where the joy of life can be found. I don’t have faith in the powers that be anymore, but they’re not the ones I fight for anymore. It’s those little sparks of joy amidst the wasteland that make the struggles worthwhile.

… And I guess all that applies to Shin Megami Tensei V as well.


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in reply to @JoyfulSanity's post:

I've got a half finished playthrough of SMTV that I really did enjoy I just shelved it for whatever reason. May switch over to this when it's cheaper since the add ons seem potentially worth the hassle.

Damn it. I was planning on getting this later but may have to get it sooner. What system did you play on, do you know if it includes all the dlc from V. I read that they plan to pull the dlc for V in the eshop once Vengeance is released. Not sure if its true or not but kind of makes sense. Since it could push for more sales.

Good questions! I've been playing this on PC via Steam, and so far performance has been great. The Steam Deck did struggle in the intro sequence, so you may have to lower settings for that, but after that point it's performed great on the handheld for me.

Since this is my first run through SMTV, I think all the past DLC is here. I've accepted quests that correspond to the four optional packs the base game had (including the fight against the Demi-fiend and all that), so it looks like that's intact. There are a couple DLC things that are exclusive to the digital deluxe version, but I think those are new in this case. Hope that helps!

I actually did do a bit of docked play. It wasn't exhaustive, but my general finding was that at 1600 X 900 resolution, it ran pretty well. I didn't get a smooth 60 FPS, but it seemed to stay above 50. Punching it up to 1920 X 1080 pushed it into the 40 range, but it was definitely playable.

I don't know if there are any other sections like the introduction, which the deck really couldn't handle for whatever reason (I had to crank the resolution way down to get through it, but shortly afterwards I was fine to adjust the settings back up). I think if you plan on a mix of portable and docked play, Steam Deck should still be enjoyable . But if you're thinking of mostly playing on the big screen and want the crispest visuals, PS5 is probably better.

There may be a day one patch that might change things too, so take these findings with a grain of salt.

They said that the DLC would be delisted today (6/13), but I still them up. Honestly though, you should get the new version, as it has a whole story (more like a new game actually) which is much better than the original one (or so they say), and it includes all the previous dlc except the Mitamas and a few new ones.

Yup thinking the same thing. It includes all the dlc plus new story, there is also 80 additional music tracks (I think). I may just get it on the switch though I have been a sucker for shiny graphics lately. Will probably be switch version. Maybe lol.

Yes, it's 89 additional music tracks and the new campaign is as big as the older one (~80 hours).

I don't know how will fare the Switch version for the new game, but the og was awful. Lots of micro-stutters, fps drops (that made me fail jumps) and texture pop ins. I actually stopped playing on my Switch to play on emulation.

Your mileage may vary though, because when I reported that, a lot of people called me crazy. 🙄

Missing byline: Da’at Ass

Great write up, thanks for dropping it here! I had no idea SMTV:V was a thing. Also I won’t even ask about the Kotaku bit - it seems like good enough work but man, once they shut the comments off, that’s a real slippery spot. Hope it serves you well as long as it can.

Thanks for reading! As far as Kotaku goes, honestly I can't complain. The writers there have been really nice to me, and I've been able to write about the games I want to play (Like SMTV:V!). Given the state of everything this year, I'm really happy to have the work. That said, the reservations are duly noted.

As the resident SMT no-lifer, I'll give this a read after I wake up.

Hopefully, you make the jump to other notable SMT titles like Strange Journey, Digital Devil Saga or the Nocturne remaster (the save states and updated demon fusion makes it infinitely more playable). SJ takes a minute to get going, but it's worth it (assuming the remaster, if that's the version you choose, isn't a drastic departure from the original).

SJ is actually one of the ones I've played! Loved it on the DS, didn't get around to trying the 3DS version. I've also picked up and put down the first SMT for the SNES several times. The first game's actually how I was introduced to the series.

Nocturne and 4 definitely deserve my time, though. Vengeance does have some really nice QoL that I imagine I'd miss from going backwards, but I'd love to see how those titles hold up otherwise.

Keep in mind that IV also takes a while to get going, which is the only reason I didn't mention it. It's not as slow Persona 4's initial 3 or 4 hours, but it's infamous nonetheless. There's also a mid-game lull where mostly nothing happens until the [redacted] bit.

With that said, IV is my favorite. It being my first, I'm probably biased as it has other sizable issues aside from pacing (namely the balance issues; pouring points into magic is basically the only viable option when you consider the damage output), but the atmosphere is second to none.

Apocalypse improved the balance and gameplay and is the closest to V in regards to QoL (it being the most recent before V), though the story is pretty cringe. It completely went against what I expected, tonally, from an SMT game.

I'm glad they dialed back the power of friendship nonsense with V, albeit via just making it completely flat and soulless.

Either the Nocturne remaster or Digital Devil Saga (the PS3 digital re-releases are the PAL region versions and thus have pretty bad audio sync issues, so you'd need a PS2 + an NA copy) would be good ones to move on to. Then maybe IV. At that point, you'd be fine throwing a dart at most remaining SMT games.

I did stop my playthrough of V in order to finish III which I stopped because choosing a path makes me anxious. 😅
As a fan of the series I already preordered this one, but now I wonder if I should pick my playthrough back up or if I should start a brand new file in Vengeance. Or maybe actually power through III only I'm not sure if I want the TDE or Isamu's path (though honestly the choices to get there are ... ugh).
I enjoyed the original V for what I played of it but it was 100% thanks to the gameplay and art direction, the story alternated between botched and plain bad. I wonder how I'll feel about V-V.

V's focus on the open world to the detriment of the narrative, of which there was barely any, was a major turn off for me and I never got far, but I still want to check this out at some point.

Nice write up! I can't wait to play this game again. I wonder if the poison build is still strong on Vengeance. I wanna do the Vengeance path but I will miss on all the cool demons you can get on the "Origin" path. I wonder if you can get those on the new path.

Thanks for reading! I'm still tearing through the Vengeance route myself, though I imagine all those details will become clear in the next few days. I personally haven't used status ailments that much (getting critical hits while screaming ARAMASA!! has been my preferred early game strat), but I think something like poison should still be good (haven't encountered many enemies that are immune to it). I'll be interested in seeing what the theorycrafters come up with.

Poison was a mid-game strategy I used where you can easily poison most enemies with Toxic Spray/Breath+Poison Adept, and use Venom Chaser to finish enemies off. Worked on a lot of bosses too!

Also, Poison+Poison Master stacks, so you get triple damage on poison ticks, heh.

"I like to think of the fused monsters as Pokemon-style evolutions rather than flat-out replacements, even if the lore of the game doesn’t necessarily support that interpretation."

No but it does tho!!! Least in the SMT series overall, it does! The Devil Survivor games contains dialogue pre-fusion from some demons who are both aware of fusion and are excited to become a new demon, which implies a degree of not viewing being fused as a "Death" as it were. There's also instances like in Nocturne where if you remember which demon has the first Pixie you ever received in their fusion lineage, you can take that demon to a specific room and they'll revert back to the Pixie (Albeit super buffed with late game spells).

So it is implied that somewhere in the primordial goo, your old demons are still in there!

Oh that's awesome! I absolutely loved Devil Survivor back in the day but I must have missed that, guess I'm a decade overdue for a replay!

I'm not sure why I had the impression that the fusion process was darker than it was, but it alleviates my conscience knowing that's not the case. :)