im postin here bc i dont want to unintentionally start Local Queer Drama and i cant figure out a way to word this that conveys that i am intellectually curious about why myself and some other queers ive talked to feel really uncomfortable at Local Gay Bar M, but fine at Local Gay Bar T. Like, I have tried going to M several times under a couple different circumstances/events and have come to the conclusion that, compared to my experience at T, its clear its not just my normal anxiety and Autistic overwhelm from being in A Bar, but I straight up dont enjoy being at M. As a person new to going to bars at all and an incorrigible Autistic Observer of Behavior, i find this fascinating and I am curious to get to the bottom of it. The day after I had this realization I mentioned it in casual conversation with 3 different local queers, none of whom i know very well, and all 3 of them were like 'oh yeah, i really feel bad when i go to M, too'. though they each had slightly different thoughts about why that is, we all admit it kind of ephemeral and like, "vibes-based". And thats interesting to me!! i want to solicit more opinions/a discussion about this, but i just know if i post on Queer Exchange or Lex about this its going to get the people who DO like M very defensive and angry and also attract anyone who is particularly bitter about M out of the woodwork and just become a toxic mess.

so my initial theories are below. none of this is necessarily criticism, im just analyzing why i don't like it. it is in order from most concrete to most ephemeral


  1. Space. M is in a narrow storefront and gets crowded fast, theres no stage, and not even that many places to sit. Even when im seated its impossible to not feel like im in the way no matter where i am. My hairdresser pointed out that theres nowhere in the space that you dont feel incredibly exposed and visible. Writing now, im realizing that even the outdoor space where people go to smoke and chill is just the sidewalk of main street, so stepping outside didnt even feel like a reprieve.

T has a stage and a big dance floor as well as couches and tables at the periphery. You can choose whether to exist in the middle of everything or more out of the way, and you can do the former while taking breaks with the latter. I get anxious about being in the way there, too, but i usually eventually can relax somewhat.

  1. Decoration/lights/neurospicy-unfriendly. M is very bright for a bar, has a lot of beautiful art and decorations and generally has a maximalist aesthetic, has 3 big TVs over the bar, just.....theres a lot going on, visually. T is darker, often has decorations for themed dances but theres just not as much visually screaming for my attention. This affects my cognition and my ability to socialize and speak.

  2. Vibe/who its appealing to. This is totally ephemeral but what i realized the last time i went to M, on Friday, was that it felt like I was back at a party thrown by the Cool Queer Kids in college, feeling hopelessly out of place and uncool. I dont feel like the actual people at M are like that, but I think it appeals to a similar affinity group of queers as the Cool Queers from early college and thus is alienating to people who have more bad memories associated with that type of place. I simply dont feel that way in T.

Since we have 2 queer bars within a 30 min drive of one another, its not a bad thing if they each have a slightly different tho overlapping audiences they appeal to. I think T is going for more of an audience of outcasts, goths, people who dont feel like they fit in even in queer spaces, and M is going for more of a glitter queer audience.

  1. Culture. This is the spiciest and least evidenced theory, and what 99% of people will assume i mean if i ask broadly "hey why does being in M feel so relentlessly bad?" But its possible there is a contributing factor of how people are acting towards each other and me that is making me feel unwelcome and anxious in M and only my normal background-radiation-anxiety in T. If this was happening there is a 0% chance i would be able to catch on that it was happening to me because I am Autistic and cant understand complex social dynamics or accurately read emotions and facial expressions. But i also know that even in situations where i have been unaware that i was being treated badly, it still felt bad.

Determining whether i feel bad bc i am actually being treated badly or whether i feel bad due to paranoia and anxiety is literally the struggle of my entire life as an Autistic person. I would love to solicit the opinions of people who are more socially savvy than me, whether theyve had specific experiences at M they can point to as being made to feel unwelcome, but alas, that would just become toxic immediately. Im left asking my personal friends and acquaintences but so far no one has mentioned any specific interactions that were bad. i also know one person who has felt extraordinarily welcomed at M, who is a regular now, and for whom thats been a really lovely and meaningful queer experience for them. So maybe things 1-3 put myself and certain other queers in a state where it is just impossible to be open to that kind of positive experience, so all you really get from being there is the negative. if thats the case it is the fault of no one who goes or works there.

i know i am allowed to just not like a place, but i really wanted to like M, they do a lot of cool-sounding events, and i have a friend who really does like it and the people there. i just find this interesting idk.


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