yaodema

Eventual artist

  • she/they

https://yaodema.com/


building the Hyperion setting, writing and drawing comics for that and others' worlds -- plus making tools for others to use for their own art!


Researchying (OOPs lore and other things)


I made that transformation hazard sign
(and self-replication too)


Zelda years old (1986)


adorablesergal
@adorablesergal

Being on Mastodon is fun, but holy smokes, those guys want you to content-warning everything, it feels like--even crying. And I'm like, what, a basic display of emotion gets a content warning? It's not even extreme sobbing over some dead body; we're not pondering skipping out on a viewing of Grave of the Fireflies because we're already in a downer mood; it just appears to be a character sheet that happens to have several headshots of example emotions, and crying happens to be one of them. I see them on more advanced ref sheets all the time.

I get the warnings for, like, blood or guns or spiders. I can imagine why someone might not want to see those, but yeah, I dunno. Like, by this logic, you could content-warning happiness, too, if you're sad and you don't want to see someone else being joyful. Like, where is the line between content warnings, and regular run-of-the-mill content tags? Is just the semantics of it tripping me up?


Westor
@Westor

I think a lot of people on Mastodon have forgotten what Tumblr taught us about trigger warnings and trolls


whit
@whit

this is sincerely one of the major reasons I just can't use mastodon. My friends on there are very soft hearted and want to protect people from harm but this leads to what feels like every other post having some content warning for something extremely mild or anodyne and I just can't deal with it. It's one of the few things that makes me feel that icy touch of "the conservatism of age" that we were warned about, so I have to keep myself out of it so I don't lose my empathy or sensitivity.


kukkurovaca
@kukkurovaca

The issue is that it's a shibboleth for at least a couple of different actual divisions, some of which I don't care about and some of which I do.

The reason why a lot of folks, myself included, have a kind of kneejerk negative response to content warning maximalists is that historically policing content warnings is strongly correlated with white people on mastadon making it unusable for non-white people.

(In many ways, a descriptive tagging system combined with tag filtering would be a much better solution, but not enough people reliably use tags either -- it's me, I'm terrible about that. Twitter clout weirdos made tags so uncool that we haven't yet recovered, even on sites like Mastodon and Cohost where tagging is functionally crucial if you want things to be findable.)

Anywho, whenever I'm asked to CW something (either personally, or generally) that I wouldn't instinctively put a warning on, I try to sort it into one of two groups:

  • is this a CW that is inconvenient to me just because I am not personally harmed by it, whilst others are
  • is this a CW that is enabling people people with privilege to render the lived experience of others invisible

There are some things that are genuinely hard to put into just one of those buckets. A lot of political content is like that; there's a lot of political stuff that is just electoral gamesmanship and dunkfests which folks should rightfully be able to avoid, but there's a lot of political stuff, some of which is electoral, which existentially threatens folks' lives, and it's messed up to ask them to hide it by default.

In conclusion, Mastodon is exhausting


nicky
@nicky

this is a real problem within the broad culture there. it was never explained to me why my face was so offensive i had to hide it from everyone, just an expected behavior i was supposed to have already known about. very alienating


Pixl
@Pixl

ngl i started tagging everything arbitrarily on an instance i was on (post snouts) and people started getting annoyed, so i figured they just hated any kind of interaction in general with this damned if you do damned if you don't mindset


yaodema
@yaodema

yeah I ran into all of this and its knock-on effects when I was still actively using mastodon. now the instance I was used to using is dead and I had to migrate, and I just... don't see much point in continuing to use it, honestly. the very protocol it's built on is kind of a mess, and mastodon's additions to it made it messier. then you add social cross-instance issues like this to the pot and oof

I remember people getting mad at misskey users for "making weird overly long CWs that don't warn about anything" because they... used it as a summary field. which, according to spec, is what it is. plus the whole thing with CWs would be a moot point if they just had a tagging system... which we have right here!

cohost is a work in progress, yet we are so spoiled by how good we have it here already


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in reply to @adorablesergal's post:

the mastodon culture around content warnings is extremely toxic, honestly. People can have trauma triggers around just about anything, which is totally valid, but individuals cannot anticipate everyone else's possible triggers

cws are for stuff that's usually or inherently traumatic, not like, all food ever, and the dynamic that's lead to people asking for content warnings on everything is a hypercorrective one

Instinctually, I feel the same way. There's just some stuff that's kinda messed up, and even though my perception of what "messed up" is is hopelessly skewed, there's still pretty obvious cases like gore and death.

But I want to be better than that. I wasn't all that great before, and so I want to do things right. A lot of the old me still leaks through, and I float through the Internet in a superposition of wanting to be compassionate, but also smelling blood in the water and going in for the kill because that's what we did back then. It was our own really horrid form of protection.

So now I try to stop myself and think about things if someone claims I crossed a line. I wish it was easier to figure this stuff out.

I have trouble seeing things like Mastodon style content warnings as indicative of leftism as a whole. While common in certain places, I still see them as part of a relatively minor subculture within/overlapping with leftism. Now, I don't use mastodon anymore and I no longer really see anything like that content warning culture outside of references to mastodon or sometimes old tumblr.

With so much going on in my life, I shorthand leftist concepts broadly even though I'm fully aware there's lots of nuance and philosophies and schools of thought. For me, it comes down to either giving a damn about others, or not giving a damn about others. Most of the rest is details, so naturally I would want to not be a jerk by spamming spiders on my timeline without warning. It may not be borne of some grand socioeconomic idea, but it's thoughtful, and is, I feel, indicative of quite a lot.

Except it does get exhausting, and it lends itself to a low-grade paranoia, which, I tend to go off on rants a lot, and so I'm left wondering if I'm going to regret clicking that "submit" button. I missed out on tumblr culture; I was more on the SA/4chan side of things, so there's a desire to overcorrect, perhaps, because it feels like that old trashy self is never far beneath the surface.

I have this same feeling honestly, honestly pften having a hard time feeling like a good leftist for having some issues anticipating what to cw because almost nothing phases me abd im really bad at having basic empathy.

I want to have basic empathy though, its hard.

But at least I get to see Nazis eat shit. That's a pretty decent consolation prize.

somewhat related: its been way too long since i last saw The Gif

i get it. i was an enthusiastic masto user for a year or two starting around 2017 but i got to a point in my life where i was quite unhappy and the emotional friction of needing to studiously CW so often there felt like too much of a lift, and it put me off posting... and i drifted away.

anyway, it's been nice since to see some degree of pushback to the concept. it felt overbearing.

Hey, same internet era! I feel you on not beloning to whatever future maybe built. For the longest time I've had people say they were unsure about me because I was too 'edgy' only for them to listen and find out it was in a socially, progressive way they were unaccustomed to. Its something I've always pegged from the general culture at the time: I'm not wanting to compare myself to George Carlin or David 'If you work in advertizing, kill yourself' Hicks, but I think a lot of us drew inspiration from how jagged we'd talk about the right back when it was called NRx and we'd be on forums arguing against them, as they advocated the bizarre unthinkable. Like bringing back slavery to establishing an american monarchy.

Its was such an environment to be in that it leaves a fingerprint, and can't say I'm surprized to the new generation that they pick-up on the rough corners. I don't think there is anything wrong with the approach 'block and move on' if people don't tag correctly, but having read and thought about what you've wrote. I worry about how if this is how they're handling things, not just at mastadon but wider, how they'll manage the coalition-building and garnering the support of allies to create effective, lasting change.

About the CWs and Mastodon, i think the overall thing that's going on is that it's becoming a default "Posts should be hidden until clicked, except for junkfood-grade posts", and the CWs are essentially becoming more of a TL;DR bit, so that you know what you're getting into if you click it, more than actual warnings about sensitive content within.

It feels more like how the tags were being used many forevers ago.

Also, a lot of people default to wanting just to scroll along and see casual distractions while something else is keeping their mind busy, not something they'll have to think about somehow.

Which isn't really the best, but blah.

But yeah, i've just been handling it as, if what i'm going to post on there is a short dumb thing that doesn't require thinking, i'll post it as-is, if not, i'll just throw a short bit as to what it's about.

Like, if this was on Mastodon, it'd probably get a CW saying "Mastodon stuff, CWs, theories as to how people operate." or something along those lines.

Nothing related to specific sensitive content within, just a "This is what it's about, click if you want." thing.

What's hit me the most around this topic is the push I've seen from some people to CW fursuit photos with a warning for eye contact, which in furry spaces (which Masto isn't per se but one of the supposed perks of federation is that we can isolate our community) feels really awkward and ill-fitting? And really highlights IMO the move from useful CWs to a kind of hypercorrection, as it were. But then I start wondering whether I'm the bad guy for thinking that and not just going along with the flow?

I've been trying to be a good internet user and started using Masto more some months back because of everything happening around Twitter (plus killing off 3rd party apps), but I've found it to be a very joyless and almost anti-social social media experience for many reasons. It's like this nagging invisible pressure to post on eggshells which isn't the feeling I want from a casual social site. And this comment doesn't really have a point, but I saw this on my timeline and it just felt nice to see someone else has been swirling similar thoughts around this.

in reply to @Westor's post:

for whatever reason mastodon's cultural norms are that everything goes in the CW/subject field. there isn't really a strong culture there for "use tags for niche CWs". not sure why.

I think part of it is that people already use the subject field (this is what the underlying protocol and several fedi servers call it) as a... subject line... for long posts. if I'm writing a thousand words about cpu architectures I'll "CW" it "ash rambles about ISAs" despite the fact that I doubt there is anyone that would need that CWed, because that's the closest you can get to a readmore that will be widely respected.

ultimately i don't think it's better or worse, just different. I've seen at least one person complain about cohost's relative lack of CW culture!

in general I just CW for nsfw/gore/other common things, write subject lines for long posts, and it's fine. in four years and 60k posts i've gotten a grand total of one person who reported me (I run my own instance so I see all reports), it was vague, and I just ignored it because it was anonymous so I couldn't ask for clarification.

in reply to @whit's post:

Yeah, for me at least I mean I can feel in myself a dark timeline where that irritation leads to me being the kind of person who wants to be cruel to people who are easily harmed, or becoming an asshole about kids these days and the things they think are important (since I'm in my 40s, this is something I always try to keep in my head when I'm like, no, it's the children who are wrong.) it's highly unlikely I'd turn into a "content warnings? those are for SNOWFLAKES" person but sometimes, sometimes I worry.

It's just like, I can't imagine that if a friend approached you and said they were struggling with certain stuff, that you wouldn't easily agree to flag it for them. That's your heart and your values.

It's true, it's true! And I absolutely do! I just used to be real piece of shit in my younger, unmedicated days and was a real asshole at times, so I'm always on guard, knowing that that sort of ugliness was ever a part of me.

It's one of the few things that makes me feel that icy touch of "the conservatism of age" that we were warned about

you're definitely not alone here. the process I've fallen into is to see this stuff, say "hmm", and close the tab

in reply to @kukkurovaca's post:

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